I want to try to arrange some sort of deal with an otherworldly entity, but nothing so extreme as to sell my soul. In short, I'm not a tall guy but I want to be. I was cheated out of being tall (being 8 inches shorter than every other guy in my family) for some reason, and I considered using something like Messeth to gain some height.
So how do I make an exchange for whatever in return for being tall?
Genetic/physical changes, if at all possible, would require tremendous energy involvement as a trade off. Probably larger of a sacrifice then what you are willing to offer.
If you must experiment, for your own reasons, with such Beings, I would strongly suggest finding a small, manageable goals that can be accounted for (verifiable metrics, a specific milestone to reach).
As an alternative, you could always work hard, get other more important things in order and earn something around 10,000 dollars and get leg extension surgery. Though it takes something like 10 months of excruciating physical therapy to recover from the surgery and you'll at most gain 4 inches.
"being 8 inches shorter than every other guy in my family"
Sounds to me like your special. Why would you want to be a part of the norm?? Out of all the mental and genetic disorders in the world that could have been had, being short is high on the rather have list.
No. 20110 - The King In Yellow - February 5th, 2012 - 6:01 PM
Now I will also suggest against summoning up demons as nothing good can come out of it but I have another idea for you to get your height. I have a lot of extra height that I don't need but I am very weak. Maybe we can find a ritual to trade a small portion of my height (4 inches or so) for some extra strength or stamina from you. If any one knows some thing that can cause a trade of features between people please post it. thank you.
>>20106
If you want to contact something, as safe as these things go, try to reach out and find a guardian (guardian, angel, totem, spirit companion... frame it as you are comfortable.) Be nice, polite and not greedy. See what you get from that and evaluate from there.
You really shouldn't listen to all this talk about "demons" and dangers and the like.
Simply put: Knowledge is power, and if you do the research first nothing will ever be dangerous.
I advise you to look into the writings on chaos theory and discordianism. In particular, you may be interested in "Aspects of Evocation" and "Condensed Chaos" (both by Phil Hine), as well as the wide variety of available resources on kabbalistic traditions such as The Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn.
Goetia, too, may be of interest. But you should try to gain a basic understanding of it from neophyte texts of The Golden Dawn, or the "beginners" series by people like Hine.
What >>20103 says is basically true. This sort of goal is going to be difficult to enact, let alone verify. But nevertheless, best of luck.
>>20112
Given my assumption that he's a beginner with trying to contact something inhuman (not necessarily demonic) it's dangerous. Stuff like this isn't really something you can just read a .pdf then pull it off.
I still advise against it. Being 'short' isn't really a big deal, I view the sort of trade your wanting as something you won't get, not for too large a price.
If you read the Keys of Solomon it'll tell you how to get anything you want by casting a summoning for Lucifer or Satan. Its not particularly easy and you could probably be die or be eternally damned...
No. 20120 - GoetIncubus - February 12th, 2012 - 3:05 AM
To the folk claiming that summoning demons/other entities is dangerous, is this based on actual experiences you've had with summoning demons? When this topic comes up, people will quickly throw in the idea that Horrible Things Are Bound To Happen, but it's never backed up by personal experience - only second or third hand accounts of what other people have claimed (often from when they were younger and/or with misguided or unprofessional folks), or else, based entirely on the fact that demonology has long been associated with evil and they decide to propagate the idea without exploring it for themselves. I'm not at all suggesting summoning Belial and Beelzebub is either "good" or "evil" here, I'm just asking what folks' reasons are to claiming they usually result in negative experiences.
>>20118
As far as I know, neither Key of Solomon gives techniques on how to summon Lucifer/Satan, unless you're counting other names like Astaroth or Baal as belonging to the same entity.
No. 20121 - Hermit - February 12th, 2012 - 10:39 AM
>>20120
My warning, if you want to call it that, was more about a heads off about trade and energy requirement. "No free lunch" and all of that. And does come from having made the mistake of having too large of a request, too vague maybe, which bit me in the ass.
Mostly was an energy drain, but it affected my health in turn and i got, in succession : sinusitis, laryngitis (including no voice for a week), bronchitis, food poisoning (from the chicken soup and tea I had been eating trying to recover from the above) and a few weeks of back-to-back migraines.
As opposed to, under normal circumstances, me getting maybe 6 migraines a year and 3 days cold in the winter.
So there is a way to do this? I would like to practice on a much smaller scale, but I think basically my idea is that I could trade something for something else. So what would the smallest trade be?
Speaking as an anon who had friends who flirted rather openly with many beings (not neccessarily daemons) I can say you are being exceptionally stupid for thinking anything comes without substantial price (from our perspective), the very logic that humans have no excessive power and other entities do means we are always at a disadvantage in any of these deals (in terms of power at least, humans are third world countries and these entities are rich western nations. I think that's an appropriate analogy) Of Course I am a Catholicfag, raised in the Irish Countryside with peripheral knowledge of these kinds of things but with a healthy dislike of them, so naturally I am heavily biased against encouraging sorcery, so that's why I am trying to make appeals to logic here. I had once advised one of my friends who was into this sort of thing that if he was to go through with it, (he was doing a kind of spiritworld walking deal, trippy as fuck) he should heavily invoke the protection of his own guardian angels or that of Saints so that he could protect himself. Of course such beings would either block any attempt you'd make at trading with an entity that would be interested in trading with you, or simply refuse to protect you and let your actions fall on your own head.
>>20144
It is very hard for us to indicate a way for you to do, as we lack the most basic of information.
What are you familiar with? What have you tried, what is your level of comfort?
How do you frame your supernatural/magical reality? In Christian/Catholic terms? In Shamanistic/Totemic terms? Wiccan? Judaic/Kabbalistic? Shinto and spirits? Ancestors? A mix of everything (also known as chaos magic)?
Note that all the answers are correct (from my point of view, YMMV). However the way to obtain what you seek varies greatly depending on your approach.
>>20158
Well I was raised Jewish, but I never learned too much about the Kabbalah, and I'm not familiar with too much, so you could consider me a neophyte, or a completely clean slate. I have a friend that is really into this but he wouldn't help me unless I had some information, so he would be able to understand all of this more than I can.
>>20158
This is off topic but do you suggest that the way that you view reality can shape how effective/noneffective or even existent supernatural phenomenon happen?
>>20177
I think it does. The human mind is both very supple and very strict. If you take a very devout Christian/Catholic and tell him to contact his animal totem (or local kamis, or the Triple Goddess), he/she will rise in anger and will refuse the mere idea. However, if you advise the same person to direct their request to a particular Saint or Angel (or order of Angels) they will accept this as not only possible but true.
The same thing works in reverse, someone of any non Christian/Catholic background being told to pray to a particular Saint for the safety of their house, an other for Health, and a third for travels will not believe it can do any good and may refuse to do so.
Belief is the corner stone. Most magic is enacted by the power of the will over reality (mind over matter). If you go through a ritual but your mind is filled with doubts, disgust, or anything countering belief you will not see results. Anything that happens afterward will be understood as luck, coincidence, or other such thing.
In the same order of things, someone who is a true skeptic, who keeps a narrow view of reality, who refuses any other input then what he believes to be real, may go through his whole life and never experience anything "supernatural". Those things simply do not exist in his reality, therefore he cannot see or feel them, nor their actions around him.
>>20178
But since I have seen the power of mind over matter, placebo effects, and willpower in action, it is a basis for which to expand my mind and accept whatever it is to make a physical change to my body. I've seen the mind do incredible things to the body, why can't mine do the same?
Well, since it's been half a year and I still have no information on how I can accomplish my goal, i guess I'll kill myself or something. Thanks anyway guys
We gave you information. We gave you points to start researching on your own. We cannot draft your incantations for you, nor calculate the exact time of day/week/month/year for you location when it would be more auspicious.
If you are unable to help yourself at this level, how did you figure you would come out on top when dealing with forces beyond your own strength?
>>20350
Take that kind of summer faggotry back to /x/. This is why I have, and will continue to vote block on every single unregistered post I see, regardless of its content.
I'm not the above Anon or OP. I'm a registered member who posts anonymously simply because I don't know how others will react to some of the questions, complaints, or advice that I give. I feel, that as a newer member I should try and learn a thing or two before making myself openly look like a fool.
That said, as for OP, I don't think that there is anything that can be done for a deficit in physical form. If he was able to make some kind of deal, it would most likely be for something physical, or for a greater price, something spiritual. I don't think, however, that he could ever trade for some kind of physical alteration of his body, as that is not something that can be done, as it is a matter of genetics, and not easily manipulated or obtained through any other means than genetics.
As for >>20153
I regularly try to dissuade the contact of any sort of entity that is sentient and non-human. I by theory consider most intelligent 'ghosts' for example just shards of a person that are residual, but non-human entities that are not angelic or demonic in nature can be highly dangerous (given you believe they exist, I have my doubts).
For >>20350
I don't have a problem with posting anonymously. This thread by nature seems shady/trollish. And juvenile stuff like >>20350 is just garbage. I view sanctuary as a very open, non-top heavy forum. So worrying about a possibly controversial viewpoint is kind of moot I think. The very nature of the site itself is pretty open-minded. Part of the reason we stay 'pure' from trolling and summerfags like /x/ has is the registering of posters, which is a pretty painless process. Hence, I very regularly vote block on unregistered posts.
Me thinks >>20350 is a troll, but OP had a pretty good question that I can't find the answer to either. Could physical manipulation be accomplished by a metaphysical energy or being?
That kind of depends firstly on your definition of physical manipulation other than the obvious. The human brain is capable of an immeasurable influence on your perception of reality, even tactile. Do I think that some sort of entity can actually touch me physically? Harm me? I'm going to say I doubt it.
Due to my beliefs of what entities mainly are, for me there are 3 possibilities: ghostly entities, demonic, or even angelic. As far as ghosts go it's my opinion following research and experience that all ghostly activity is in some form or another residual, even if something seems intelligent and sentient it is just a shard of that person (if you will) While they are able to manifest 'feelings' like temperature changes and such physical interaction is exceedingly rare. Given it's so easy to fake and false positives until I experience it myself, I'd say no. To me it seems that haunting work on an energy system of some sort where it takes x amount of 'energy' to perform x action, irregardless if it's auditory, or a full apparition. The amount of energy needed to manifest anything at all seems to be quite large across the board, and I'd put moving anything at the very top of the scale.
Inhuman entities....are more complicated. I'd say the ball is mostly in their court. Religiously going off biblical reference angels seem fully capable of human interaction, though curiously on both sides there is very little real physical interaction between them and humans which I find odd. Demons for example, exert influence and posses people but no instances of one harming a person directly. Same with angels. The story of Lot and Sodom/Gomorrah comes to mind, the angels God sent acted very strangely. They spoke and ate but didn't touch anyone (or if they did it wasn't mentioned) though they did seem to magically cause blindness in an entire crowd by supernatural means.
Just as a personal opinion I think that after AD 30/33 (whenever crucifixion actually was) that the direct interference and interaction between mortals and the supernatural world, as it were, abruptly ceased.
It would seem to me that a demon, or angel, or whatever would be far more likely to influence you in some way, or make you feel a certain way (like feeling sick, making you want to scratch yourself for 'demon scratches, ect) than actually touching you.
Basically tl;dr short version is yes and no.
In my experience although there is a lot of action on the incorporeal/mental/spritual side of things the actual physical presence and manifestations affecting the physical world of anything paranormal are a very, very small percentage of activity, if it happens at all. >>20427
